JD Abshire Supporter

In Matthew 16:16 Peter responded to the the Lord Jesus after being asked whom did he say the Son of man is. " And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God."

In v. 17 " And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven."

V. 18 " And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."

The "rock" throughout the Word of God is Christ. 1 Corinthians 10:4 " And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ." This passage refers back to Exodus 17:6.

Caththolocism claims that Peter is the rock and have built the papacy and church on this erroneous misunderstanding of scripture.

To answer your question, NO! When the cornerstone of the foundation is wrong and out of whack, the whole house is crooked.

March 04 2014 • 7 responses • Vote Up • Share • Report

Steve Nearman Supporter A sinner saved by grace. Fredericksburg, VA

I was raised in Catholicism. One of my first scriptures studies after salvation was Mat 16:18-19. to see of Peter was the first pope. Using my newly purchased Strong’s concordance I found Peter was petros (a small stone), rock was petra (a large rock) and church was elkesia (a called out group of people, an assembly or congregation). 

Doing a word study on "rock" reviled that when it was referencing a person in every cased Jesus Christ or Lord was the subject. In never referred to some else; Ps 44:8 "Do not fear, nor be afraid; Have I not told you from that time, and declared it? You are My witnesses. Is there a God besides Me? Indeed there is no other Rock; I know not one.” Ex 17:6, Num 20:8-11, Deut. 32:4; 13-15; 18, 30, 37; 1 Sam 2:2; 2 Sam 22:2, 32, 47; Ps 18:2, 31, 46; 28:1; 31:2; 40:2; 42:9; 61:2; 62:2, 6-7; 71:3; 78:16, 20, 35; 89:26; 92:15; 94:22; 95:1; 105:41; 114:8; 144:1; Is 48:21; Hab 1:12; Rom 9:33; 1 Cor 10:4; 1 Pet. 2:4-8

So if Peter was the rock in Mat 16:18 it would be the only place it was used to refer to someone other than Jesus Christ. Also consider that, just 4 verses later Jesus tells Peter “Get behind Me, Satan! You are an offense to Me, for you are not mindful of the things of God, but the things of men.” Would He build a church on a fallible man or on Himself? The answer is obvious.

Jesus told the woman at the well Joh 4:10-11 He could have given her "living water" Joh 7:38, this corresponds with the rock that Moses brought water from in Horeb Ex 17:6. The second time he brought water out of the rock, Num 20, God told him to "speak" to the rock. But Moses in his frustration and anger with his fellow Jews "struck" the rock twice. This disobedience was the reason he could not enter the promise land with his brethren. The "rock" was a type of Christ 1Cor 10:1-4 who was only to be smitten once for our sins.

For some 20 years I used that verse to show that the church which is Christ body was built on the rock-Jesus Christ not Peter. About 15 years ago I saw something different. Jesus came only to the Jews Joh 1:11, lost sheep of Israel Mat 15:24. He revealed nothing about what was soon to come conceding the mystery of the church age. Otherwise it would not have been a mystery when Paul revealed it. Also His ministry was to the Jews only and concerning the kingdom Acts 1:3 not the church. I now understand the church (elkesia), in Mat 16:18, is referring to a future Jewish assembly or congregation. The same as the churches (elkesia) in Rev 1 are Jewish, for this is after the church which is Christ body has been called out of this world and the Lord is once again working with His chosen people, the Jews, in the end time prior to His millennial reign. The Greek word elkesia in Acts 7:38 is rendered congregation referring to Israel in the wilderness. It is rendered "assembly" in Acts 19:28-41 referring to a public gathering of Ephesians worshiping the goddess Diana. You have to look carefully at the context to determine what the elkesia (church, assembly, congregation) actually is. The word elkesia translated to church does not always refer to the body of Christ.

Jesus is the head of His church not a man - And He (God) put all things under His (Jesus Christ) feet, and gave Him to be head over all things to the church, which is His (Christ's) body Eph 1:22-23 

And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence. Col. 1:18, 24 

If your question is referring to the Roman Catholic church; Peter was not the rock and neither is the body of Christ the elkesia in view in Mat 16:18. Therefore to use it as proof text to establish that Peter was the first pope appointed by Christ to run His church, according to scripture, it totally bogus.

2 Tim. 2:15 Study to show yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, RIGHTLY DIVIDING the word of truth.

March 08 2014 • 2 responses • Vote Up • Share • Report

Sir douglas Ladore Supporter

The Catholic Church is established by Jesus Christ. The word "catholic" means "universal" and in that regard speaks of the universal body of Christ. Many people think that when the phrase "Catholic Church" is used together that it refers to the Roman Catholic Church. Some churches use a creed within which the term "catholic church" is used to talk about their church as being universal and insist the use of this term doesn't refer to the Roman Catholic Church. (Anglican & Episcopal) The Church's beginning by most scholars is considered to have begun at either the Resurrection of Christ and/or at Pentecost. It is also important to consider that those who think of themselves as Christians ARE in fact The (Universal) Church. It is still sad in this day and age that The Church is not in reality "Universal" and/or Ecumenical in the sense of Christian unity.

March 04 2014 • 11 responses • Vote Up • Share • Report

Richard Pogorzala Supporter

The catholic church was founded by Christ it was the unified body of Christ. The Roman catholic church came into existence when Constantine Emperor commanded that the Christian church be the official church of Rome. This also allowed all the different holidays and rituals to be allowed into this new church. Peter was the apostle to the Jews and Paul the apostle to the gentiles. Peter could never been the first pope.

March 04 2014 • 2 responses • Vote Up • Share • Report

Vincent Mercado Supporter Skeptic turned believer, Catholic, father of 3

Yes. Jesus built one church and the apostles spread this to the rest of the world. St Ignatius, in year 107, called it the Universal Church (καθολικὴ ἐκκλησία) from where we get the name Catholic Church.

Peter is the rock. Plain and simple. Not very difficult to accept it one reads the words of scripture with a clear mind. Jesus exchanges words with Peter. Notice this: Peter said "You are Son of God", Jesus said "You are son of Jonah". Peter said "You are the Messiah", Jesus said "You are rock". (Matthew 16:16)

The Catholic Church has stood for more than 2000 years. Despite her many sins, she continues to teach truth coming from Christ himself, guided by the Holy Spirit. Many have tried to bring her down, but failed. She is an anvil which have worn out many hammers.

March 05 2014 • 2 responses • Vote Up • Share • Report

Emo Tenorio Supporter Shomer

I humbly submit that man's narcissistic quest to lay any claim to the mantle of the Lord Jesus, as to being somehow superior to others is a doctrine of demons!

Scripture is quite clear on one fact, and that is God will not share His glory with anyone period, remember or reference Lucifer and his little problem. 

Matthew 16:2 the Lord confronts the religious organization of His day and calls them Hypocrites to their faces. And later in Matthew 16:6 He tells His disciples to "take heed and beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and the Sadducees".

Matthew 16:12 the Lord spells it out clearly for His slow disciples, that it was not the leaven of bread He spoke of, but the incorrect doctrine of the Pharisees and Sadducees that was the problem.

Matthew 16:18 the founding claim made in error, which is followed oddly by the Lords flaming rebuke of Peter the infallible pope in Matthew 16:23
And then humankind's great question, just who is the greatest or number one oh Lord and Jesus Himself tells us all in Matthew 18

Matthew 18:6 the Lord makes clear the judgement to fall on anyone who would exercise their proclivities on innocent children, now reference the Dubin Murphy report on priest abuse, that it happened was bad, that it was actively covered up is abhorrent.
Matthew 23:28

Consider now, would the creator and knower of all things, both known and unknown, establish such an organization and then have any part there of? Reference logical
Today you are free to weigh this matter and make your own choice without the fear and penalty of heresy, which was not the case for our brothers and sisters in the past, now let no man deceive you. Matthew 23:9

In the Lord's freedom and fearless courage............warrior on

March 12 2014 • 4 responses • Vote Up • Share • Report